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A woman passenger on a public bus from Ashdod to Jerusalem Friday was told by an ultra-Orthodox male passenger to move to the back of the bus. The man held the door of the bus open and would not allow it to move for approximately 30 minutes.
When other passengers began to complain about the delay, the driver called the police. The policeman who arrived on the scene spoke with the man and then also asked the woman, Tanya Rosenblit, to move to the back of the bus. When she refused, the man who had been holding the door alighted and the bus continued on its way.
Israeli woman refuses ultra-Orthodox dictate to move to back of bus - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News
Seeded on Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:37 AM EST
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- Public Discussion (143)
Rosenblit, who said she was dressed modestly, was traveling on Egged bus 451 to get to work in Jerusalem. She said a Haredi man, who boarded two stops after she did, refused to allow the driver to close the door after he saw Rosenblit. Rosenblit said the man called her a derogatory word for a non-Jewish woman, and told the driver it was his right to have her sit in the back and that he had paid to be able to do so.
At that point, Rosenblit said other passengers called on the driver to intervene because they were late. Some wanted to get off the bus and have their money refunded. At that point, Rosenblit said, the driver called the police.
- 19 votes
C'mon all you bleeding heart liberals. God WANTED her to go to the back of the bus!
- 7 votes
A bunch of old farts with smelly beards should be happy anyone would want to be on the same bus with them, especially a Lady. Such a Magilla over nothing.
- 20 votes
Is it not the case, that this woman disrespected Judaism. This will cause her great personal pain, as the Israelis will all turn against her for showing this disrespect.
- 5 votes
When she refused, the man who had been holding the door alighted and the bus continued on its way.
Guess we know who's really in charge. Way to hold your ground and run 'em off, Sister! :)
- 22 votes
hhabilis Don't know much about Judaism, do you, Muhammad?
Oh, I know enogh. But who are you, that sets them self up, to judge someone you don't know.
Don't answer that, it is off the topic. Sorry to the seeder.
- 4 votes
"this woman disrespected Judaism"
Nothing wrong with disrespecting anything, if you have good reasons.
Telling a woman she must sit in the back of the bus earns not only disrespect, but condemnation from all reasonable people.
- 15 votes
This is actually, pretty common in Israel. Some times these ultra-orthodox males will physically attack the women right on the bus. Religion allows weak men to think they have control over other women even the ones they don't know. Its the same power and control we see in violent police officers.
- 12 votes
Muhammad Amir - I don't think all of Israel will be against this woman. She did nothing at all disrespectful unless you're one of those backwards thinkers that think women are less than you. I think most Israelis will be for her. She paid the same fare and should be able to sit where she pleases.
- 7 votes
Stueystu,
I have, in the past, suspected that a poster on here, actually is not Arabic, but one who tries to make middle easterners look extremely bad by his posts.
- 6 votes
There are buses in orthodox neighborhoods of NYC that follow this practice. The drivers expect women passengers to board and exit through the rear doors of the buses.
- 4 votes
Wow Pat - I live near an almost exclusive Orthodox Jewish community in Brooklyn and did not know this. I am still proud of the fact that this woman didn't move.
- 5 votes
I am still proud of the fact that this woman didn't move.
Me too! Can you imagine this, in this day and age?
- 4 votes
I'm a Canadian, and when I was 15 years old and not really familiar with the redneck customs of the South, went to Florida for Christmas holiday. It was in the early 1950s. I recall being in a department store, and went to a fountain for a drink. I saw there was a sign above it that said "Colored Only", and frankly I didn't see what was wrong with my drinking out of it, and I did. But the real reason for my comment is because I went on a bus to get somewhere, and, as most kids my age tended to do where I come from, went to sit at the back of the bus. The driver said to get up and sit at the front. I refused. He said he was not going to drive the bus until I did, and I didn't, but then the passengers at the front started to get angry and I thought they were going to attack me, and a nice black lady told me to go up front, and only then did I do it. That was my first experience of what racial prejudice was all about in the southern USA. Now we see this happening among religious fantatical fundamentalists. Please do not extrapolate that to mean that all Jews are that way. This is only a tiny stupid ignorant bunch of fundamentalists who are adhering to this as a rule. The vast majority of Jews have no respect for those a$$holes.
- 12 votes
Buzz,
I grew up in the North during segregation, and there was the black and white drinking fountains, and the black and white schools, and the blacks sat in the balcony of the theater of the movies and the whites sat down below. There were restaurants that it was just "known" that blacks wouldn't into.
I walked on a street in Baltimore (another northern state) doing community development, with a young man from Biafra (I don't think it's still a country in Africa) who was in this country to attend college, and a group of men stopped and spat on us. Obviously I am white. It was an ugly, ugly time.
- 4 votes
That was my first experience of what racial prejudice was all about in the southern USA. Now we see this happening among religious fantatical fundamentalists. Please do not extrapolate that to mean that all Jews are that way. This is only a tiny stupid ignorant bunch of fundamentalists who are adhering to this as a rule.
If it were only a tiny minority, the police wouldn't be backing the actions of the fundamentalists. Obviously, it is woven into the very fabric of their society - so much so that it has become law.
- 8 votes
Grisham, did you not see the story about the Israeli policeman who tried to stop the Haradim from their antics and had a rock thrown at his head. He had to go to the hospital because of it. It's wrong to generalize.
- 2 votes
Grisham, did you not see the story about the Israeli policeman who tried to stop the Haradim from their antics and had a rock thrown at his head. He had to go to the hospital because of it. It's wrong to generalize.
So one guy stands up to the way society is treating women, gets a rock in the head for his trouble and suddenly it's only a small group of fundamentalists?
When are we going to stop apologizing for religious convictions that permeate our societies and allow for the types of things shown in this article? This isn't a small group of individuals. This is a society with a law in the books that allow the police to enforce women moving to the back of the bus. That's not generalization. That's fact.
There are some people who don't agree with the law, but that doesn't change the fact that it IS a law and is a fact of life in Israel. Enough with the PC crap of apologizing and saying only fundamentalists are responsible for this - sometimes they are but not in this case.
- 9 votes
That's bull, Grisham.
They cant even agree on it between themselves, not to mention most Israelis who despise them, and are utterly disgusted by their acts.
Chief rabbi: Israel isn't haredi land
Israel's Ashkenazi Chief Rabbi Yona Metzger on Sunday responded harshly to the ultra-Orthodox demand to operate 'kosher' bus-lines in haredi neighborhoods, saying that the haredi public had not right to impose its opinion on the rest of the population.
"We can't be the world's landlords. This isn't the haredi public's country," the chief rabbi said in an interview to Kol Barama Radio. "We have no authority to impose our opinion on others. This is a public place."
I know for a fact many citizens voted in women to lead two of our most important political parties. hence, trusting them as possible, future prime minister candidates. I know for a fact we have a women sitting as President of our Supreme court. and there are many more examples. you say many citizens agree with their acts..define many.
So one guy stands
More than one guy.
Israeli bus company return to Mea She'arim - with police aboard
A special police unit has been created to protect the buses and their passengers. Last Monday the new unit faced its first test, after someone threw a rock at a passing bus from inside a neighborhood synagogue. Eyewitnesses related that as soon as the rock was tossed, it became clear that some of the passengers were actually plainclothes officers.
The police also confront those @!$%#ers every other Saturday (or every few weeks) when they decide they're too bored to study, elect to protest (often with violence) our way of life instead.
Saying all that, I'm not saying we don't have a growing problem on our hands. this current goverment does need to wake up, smell the coffee, sort this mess out. still, your generaliztion of Israelis as a whole is wrong.
- 7 votes
Saying all that, I'm not saying we don't have a growing problem on our hands. this current goverment does need to wake up, smell the coffee, sort this mess out. still, your generaliztion of Israelis as a whole is wrong.
It wasn't a generalization of all Israeli's. Not once did I say all Israeli's or even a vast majority of Israelis. What I said was it's not some small group of fundamentalists. It's a rather large patriarchal religious group and people should stop apologizing for them. A small group of fundamentalists would be 10 or 20 people. Not thousands.
Shira Schmidt, an Orthodox woman, translator and journalist who has written editorials in defense of mehadrin buses, says it is reasonable to ask these bus companies--which are government subsidized--to supervise, regulate and clearly mark these buses. However, it is unreasonable to ask the companies to run a regular bus for every mehadrin route when there is little demand.
"Keep in mind that the vast, vast majority--probably 98 percent that Egged runs--are mixed," says Schmidt, who lives in a Haredi neighborhood and prefers to ride in sex-segregated buses when available. "And religious people have been riding these buses and putting up with it for years and years, as dress of people is getting more and more problematic . . . more exposed. . . There is raunchy music and ads that are not appropriate in the public sphere and dress that is not appropriate. The religious public has been tolerant and is still tolerant. They ride the mixed buses and they don't have a real alternative."
Schmidt says she has ridden with a private transportation company that caters to the ultra-Orthodox hundreds of times and "there's never been a problem" because passengers are able to arrange things on their own and without incident. If a woman wants to sit in front because she is not feeling well, people understand, she said.
The mehadrin lines started in 1997 as a trial project with a few lines in Jerusalem and Bnei Barak, but have expanded to include more than 30 inter-city and city lines around the country that now serve both very religious and secular passengers. The petitioners consider the current system to be discriminatory and against the law.
http://womensenews.org/story/the-world/070513/israeli-women-fight-back-bus-status
It's a religious code that is being enforced - that's not saying every Israeli is doing it or agrees with the laws, but they are laws and they aren't laws based on a tiny minority of people. That's like saying segregation in the States was based on a very small minority. It wasn't. There were a lot of people who wanted it to change, but a lot of people who didn't.
Opponents of the separation buses face an uphill struggle. Orthodox Jewish leaders are a powerful minority in Israel.
Naomi Ragen says the buses are just part of a wider menacing pattern of behaviour towards women in parts of the orthodox Jewish community.
"They've already cancelled higher education in the ultra-orthodox world for women. They have packed the religious courts with ultra-orthodox judges.
"In some places there are separate sides of the street women have to walk on."
She says that there are signs all over some religious neighbourhoods demanding that women dress modestly.
"They throw paint and bleach at women who aren't dressed modestly and if we don't draw a line in the sand here with this seat on a bus, then I don't know what this country and this religion is going to look like in 20 years," Ms Ragen said.
Petitioners like Naomi Ragen have asked Israel's High Court to either ban the segregation buses altogether or to force bus companies to provide parallel bus routes for passengers wanting to sit where they like.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6584661.stm
That sound like a very small group of fundamentalists? A minority in the big scheme of things, but a powerful minority with more than a few members.
Hopefully the higher courts do something about it, but I refuse to say it's a few crazies. It's quite a few religious crazies and that religion is why this crap is happening.
- 8 votes
From what I can find, it's Orthodox Jews who have these segregation problems. According to Jerusalem Center for Public Affairs, Orthodox Jews make up approximately 850,000 of the total population.
According to the best available studies, up to 25 percent, or 850,000, consider themselves Orthodox while an equal number consider themselves secular. That leaves 50 percent who consider themselves traditional.
That's a small fringe group of fundamentalists or a rather large group of people? That's nearly 1/8th of the entire population of Israel.
- 7 votes
a few crazies.
No one saying a few. quite a bit of them, actually. still very much a minority, however. they do not represent Israel, its character. and they most certainly do not represent our way of life.
- 6 votes
No one saying a few
Not true. This is the part I was talking about:
This is only a tiny stupid ignorant bunch of fundamentalists who are adhering to this as a rule.
And it isn't a tiny, stupid ignorant bunch of fundamentalists. It's a rather large, powerful group of fundamentalists. That's all I was getting at. I never said it represented all of Israel, just that it's not a small tiny minority and we need to stop making excuses for the religions that make this stuff possible. I would say the same about any society or group that does this sort of thing, including my own.
- 9 votes
No worries, IDF. I learned something new with your links. I'm glad to hear a majority of Israeli's don't agree with the type of treatment described in the article.
- 7 votes
Okay, I admit that I probably erred in using the word "tiny", but it certainly is not a sizeable group within Israel, or within other countries such as the USA or Canada. Many people call themselves Orthodox but they are nothing like those ultra-Orthodox fundamentalists. Even those who (in your quotation in #1.25) call themselves traditional are not necessarily the fundamental fanatics of which we are speaking. We are speaking here about those who are ULTRA-Orthodox, and they make up about 10% of Israeli society. The problems they are causing in Israel may soon be dealt with. Note this link:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle-east/ultra-orthodox-jewish-men-flouting-supreme-court-ruling-still-try-to-segregate-israeli-buses/2011/12/18/gIQA7yJN2O_story.html
- 4 votes
Excellent link, Buzz. I have to applaud the Rabbi and Nethanyu for speaking out. One part of the article said:
“I said, ‘I respected them enough with my modest dress and I don’t plan to humiliate myself to respect them or anyone else,’” she said.
It made me wonder what sort of pressure (if any) are women put under to dress modestly and what does modestly entail in regular Israeli society? Or was she only talking about in the Ultra-Orthodox area where she happened to be?
I thought maybe you or IDF would know.
- 7 votes
Although I've been to Israel a couple of times, I was in Jerusalem only once - more than 10 years ago. During that visit, which was a tour, my wife and I walked through Mea Sh'arim. The women were told to dress modestly, and insofar as I'm concerned, they did. My wife wore a loose turtleneck sweater, slacks and a scarf on her head. Even then, the women in our group were called the Hebrew word for "whores" by girls of high school age yelling out the windows of their school. I'll not forget that experience. It was only in that area where modest dress was required. In the rest of Israel everybody dressed no differently than in "Anytown", USA or Canada.
I think IDF would be more up-to-date than I am.
- 4 votes
Buzz,
more up-to-date than I am.
You're pretty much up to date, still.
Thought this was a good read, represents the mind set of most Israelis (regarding this issue).
I’m not talking about the madmen who charged at Tanya Rosenblit Friday, of course, or about the ones who beat up haredi women who came to vote for their Jerusalem neighborhood committee last week.
I feel for a large haredi camp that is stuck between the seculars and the radicals and watches helplessly as both sides engage in a mad dance on its back, not knowing where salvation shall come from.
Make no mistake about it: On the issue of the exclusion of women there will be no compromise and no negotiations. Women will travel everywhere, sing everywhere, vote, walk, be photographed, eulogize and work everywhere. Any other possibility is too despicable to even discuss.
The radicals see haredi women joining the workforce, haredi men filling colleges, the IDF’s Nahal Haredi battalion growing, the hundreds of haredim who join the Air Force – they see it, and they go crazy. Their solution, as always, is to become more radical, to threaten, to turn violent and to try and close the floodgates.
- 3 votes
Grisham, IDF and Buzz, I read your whole interaction. Now THAT'S the way to discuss the news!
Only thing I want to add is the perspective that religious extremism is not the same thing as religious devotion. I use the word "religious" under protest, as I understand that is how the world views all adherence to belief in the unseen, rather the working out of that belief.
As a person of faith, there is much that I wish would not take place, and hold the opinion that here in the US we have some freedoms that perhaps we should not have. In a free society, freedoms must be limited and augmented with control for the common good. The issue is not the freedom, but the capacity for wickedness of the human heart. However it becomes clear that once we begin to limit freedoms, those who limit them find wickedness in their midst. Consider Iran, Islam, Shariah Law. Now we have the haredim, and one member (at least) who would force a woman to move to the back of the bus. Try as I might, I cannot find any reference in the Law of Moses that supports such a demand. Yes, women are to submit, but this act was flat plain mean. If men are to be over women, it is designed to be servant leadership, operating for the good of the whole.
There is no justification in the Law of Moses for what this man did. As said the prophet of old, "These people honor Me with their lips, but their hearts are far from Me."
This is the point I am trying to make. For "true believers" the way we are to live our lives is we are to be an example of who God is, and use words if neccesary. This is the calling of Israel, as well. But I can tell you, as much as God is for order in society, He is much more concerned about wrong attitudes than He is about where someone sits on a bus.
- 2 votes
Canadian Dave
C'mon all you bleeding heart liberals. God WANTED her to go to the back of the bus!
We all know how difficult it is to include liberalism in an argument, but this one? Come on, you can do better!
- 1 vote
Or was she only talking about in the Ultra-Orthodox area where she happened to be?
This happens daily in the Flatbush area of New York City.
- 3 votes
Good for her!
- 37 votes
#2 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:44 AM ESTI'm glad she made a stand against these religious morons that think they are better than the rest of us. If they don't like a woman sitting in the front of the bus, then they all can get off and wait for the next one.
WOMEN'S Rights. She did the right thing here. She is a human being, not a slave or servant for these idiots.
- 38 votes
Glad she stood up for her rights. Disgusted that a police officer originally took the side of the woman hater, though.
- 34 votes
Like Abby said, good for the woman. What is it with these people in the ME? The Bible got it all wrong, religion, stupidity and bigotry should be the three deadliest sins.
- 19 votes
What is it with these people in the ME?
A tad too big of a brush for me, my friend.
Most of us Israelis are quite normal ;)
Two examples from the local political arena - the Labor party just recently voted in a new leader - Shelly Yachimovich. the biggest political party, Kadima, is led by Tzipi Livni. and of course, Israel shattered that glass ceiling back in 1969 already when Golda Meir was elected Prime Minister.
In no way I'm defending the crazy @!$%#ers mentioned in this seed, others. they deserve everything coming to them. just a little perspective when mentioning and/or discussing Israel as a whole.
- 18 votes
IDF
In no way I'm defending the crazy @!$%#ers mentioned in this seed, others. they deserve everything coming to them. just a little perspective when mentioning and/or discussing Israel as a whole
Might not agree with you on much, but I consider you quit level headed and know you condemn this kind of behaviour.
- 9 votes
It works the same way for Islam: those on the far right,in the US, scream how women are not treated as equals when in facts Islamic countries have had far more women as their leaders than their counter parts in the west:
http://www.guide2womenleaders.com/Muslim_Leaders.htm
Might not agree with you on much, but I consider you quit level headed and know you condemn this kind of behaviour.
I'll second that.
- 14 votes
IDFeb89
n no way I'm defending the crazy @!$%#ers mentioned in this seed, others. they deserve everything coming to them. just a little perspective when mentioning and/or discussing Israel as a whole.
Welcome to the crowd. I agree, the same thing happens with Christians, and Muslims. There are crazies on both sides, and yet people tend to paint everyone with the same brush.
It's interesting to me, and I'm probably off topic, but both the Jews and Muslims are both descendants of Abraham, and the attitude toward women among the extremists of both religions are similar to each other.
- 11 votes
It's interesting to me, and I'm probably off topic, but both the Jews and Muslims are both descendants of Abraham, and the attitude toward women among the extremists of both religions are similar to each other.
Excellent Friend rescue dogs62, you are most certainly not off topic, for you are pointing out misogyny, a truly ugly blockade against human progress.
- 13 votes
Might not agree with you on much, but I consider you quit level headed and know you condemn this kind of behaviour.
Same IDF.
Most of us Israelis are quite normal ;)
True. But the fact that the police back up this kind of action speaks volumes.
- 11 votes
There are crazies on both sides, and yet people tend to paint everyone with the same brush.
It's interesting to me, and I'm probably off topic, but both the Jews and Muslims are both descendants of Abraham, and the attitude toward women among the extremists of both religions are similar to each other.
Challenging the ideas found within those religions that so many people hold as sacred and enshrine in law isn't painting the people with the same brush - it is challenging the unsubstantiated ideas and nothing more.
It isn't just the extremists in this case either. This is a religious law that apprarently many citizens agree with because their own police force enforces it. I'm sorry, but it's time we stop apologizing for these religious ideas and see them for what they truly are.
- 9 votes
@ Grisham
But the fact that the police back up this kind of action speaks volumes.
I was thinking about that. It must be really difficult for the police to handle societal spats like that. You have to know who's in power in what district, and your own religious upbringing may be influencing your decisions....
1) The policeman tosses the haredim man off the bus. This could have well gotten blown all out of proportion, and made into a national media circus.
2) The woman gets tossed off the bus. Oh man, do we really want to go there?
3) The driver gets tossed off the bus...just kidding. The woman is made to move, granting elevated status to the haredim man among those on the bus. "The police back their play!"
4) The haredim man gets told to shut up, sit down, and enjoy the ride. We here in the US tend to favor that option, based on our history of grappling with civil rights. We cannot know all that pressures a policeman in Israel, and the tightrope he must walk to avoid what might turn into a violent confrontation, rioting in the streets, etc.
My guess is he was thinking "Are you kidding me? All the garbage going on in our world and you want to make a woman move to the back of the bus?" But he has to keep the peace.
- 2 votes
Do these 'men' ever try any of this kind of crap against other men or is intimidating women about the limit of their manhood?
- 32 votes
#3 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:53 AM ESTI applaud this courageous woman. In the spirit of Rosa Parks, I see these woman standing up to fanatical Jewish bigotry. Bravo.
Perhaps this bus company, if they have any honor and commitment to end this bigotry, should have guards accompany the bus route through the trouble areas. They were already fined by the Israeli court but it was only about $1070. dollars. A true insight into how the state of Israel handles bigotry and injustice.
- 23 votes
#4 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:05 AM ESTWhat's next, dragging her off the bus and stoning her? I swear that whole frigging region of the world is made of crazies.
- 17 votes
#5 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:05 AM ESTNot one bit different then the religious bigotry poisoning Christianity right here.
Not a damn bit of difference.
It is not the there, it is the them, as in religious morons, retards, bigots and various what nots of these untaxed ignorance factories, cults and churches and the stupid useless bastards they produce.
They got @!$%#s like that and we got Palin, Perry, Bachmann, Santorum, Paul, and Romney.
Creationists, bigots, bastards, liars, frauds, delusional half witted political preachers all claiming to work for that extra nasty Christian god of theirs.
You run into theirs on the odd bus.
In our case all the odds are just running to put us under the bus.
A religious jackasses short bus.
- 19 votes
The woman was within her rights, of course, but why didn't the driver tell the man to leave and/or wait for the next bus.
- 9 votes
Of course the biggest bigots are those who will try to link this incident to Christianity or to Palin, Perry, Santorium, Bachmann, Paul and Romney and all those half-witted preachers.
Usually these biggest bigots are so full of self-hatred they will strike out at anyone and anything.
- 2 votes
Of course the biggest bigots are those who will try to link this incident to Christianity or to Palin, Perry, Santorium, Bachmann, Paul and Romney and all those half-witted preachers.
While this incident doesn't involve Christianity or GoTp puppets, don't pretend they are all above attacking womens rights. Pointing out the injustices perpetuated by specific groups of like minded people is not bigotry.
- 12 votes
There was an article the other day where this same group, in order to stop a bus containing women sitting in the front, threw a baby in the street right in front of the bus to make it stop.
- 7 votes
we got Palin, Perry, Bachmann, Santorum, Paul, and Romney.
Creationists, bigots, bastards, liars, frauds, delusional half witted political preachers all claiming to work for that extra nasty Christian god of theirs.
You forgot to mention we also have the rustlers, cut throats, murderers, bounty hunters, desperadoes, mugs, pugs, thugs, nit wits, half wits, dim wits, vipers, snipers, con men, Indian agents, Mexican bandits, muggers, buggerers, bush whackers, horn swagglers, horse thieves, bull dykes, train robbers, bank robbers, ass kickers, @!$%# kickers, and Methodists. You can see them attending church every Sunday.
- 5 votes
How can it be right, legally or morally, to subject anyone to second-class citizenship this way? Didn't we fight this battle already? BTW...way to slip in a tip-o-the-hat to one of the classic comedies of all time!
- 5 votes
Not one bit different then the religious bigotry poisoning Christianity right here.
Not a damn bit of difference.
It is not the there, it is the them, as in religious morons, retards, bigots and various what nots of these untaxed ignorance factories, cults and churches and the stupid useless bastards they produce.
They got @!$%#s like that and we got Palin, Perry, Bachmann, Santorum, Paul, and Romney.
Creationists, bigots, bastards, liars, frauds, delusional half witted political preachers all claiming to work for that extra nasty Christian god of theirs.You run into theirs on the odd bus.
In our case all the odds are just running to put us under the bus.
A religious jackasses short bus.
You are right, we have ugliness right here in the good old U.S.A, and you've just demonstrated it.
- 3 votes
How can it be right, legally or morally, to subject anyone to second-class citizenship this way? Didn't we fight this battle already? BTW...way to slip in a tip-o-the-hat to one of the classic comedies of all time!
I completely agree. Treating women that way is despicable.
Thanks! I couldn't resist slipping that tip of the hat in after reading al ecat's list. It reminded me of the recruiting list from the movie.
- 4 votes
Blazing Saddles, Hedley LaMar for those who didn't get it.
- 5 votes
Easily within the top10 funny movies of all time.
I can't take credit for the list here though. it belongs to Edor @5.1
Why do the Abrahamic faiths, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, hate women? They produce men who are nut cases. If these guys don't want to see women, they can always stay home. After all, the Taliban made women stay home, so it's not like this is not an option. Maybe the bus company can put in a curtained-off area in the back of the bus where they can ride shielded from women if they care so much about the issue. The onus should be on the men to avoid the situation, not on the women. Good for this woman to not allow herself to be shoved around!
- 18 votes
#6 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:30 AM ESTThere already exist curtained off buses here in the U.S.A. That for through orthodox neighborhoods. The stupidity of that is that when they get off the bus they still see women everywhere.
- 16 votes
Really? I had no idea. Wonder what would happen if a woman did that here? It can't possibly be legal for buses in the US to require women to sit in curtained area.
- 9 votes
It can't possibly be legal for buses in the US to require women to sit in curtained area.
Would be interesting to hear from our local JDL chapter here on the "Vine" what they think about this.
- 12 votes
This does not happen in NYC. Those buses are private buses run by the Hasidim.
- 1 vote
Can a private bus company violate Federal protections? Not trying to start something, just curious about what the law might be.
My guess is they'd say something along the lines of "What's it to ya?" or "Mind your own business" following the tactic to deflect criticism and impune the critic.
- 8 votes
The dept of transportation (DOT) does have authority over private buses that operate in the US.
Is That "Hasidic Bus" Company Still Ordering Women To The Back Of The B110?
- 9 votes
Was there not a seed recently about Ultra-Orthodox Jews in NY putting up street signs telling women to NOT WALK on the same side of the street as men?
Never heard about any prosecution over that.
Seams like a certain group of citizens are "Ultra Super Citizens" who are above the Law in the USA, just like here on the "Vine"
- 11 votes
It DOES happen in NY, and with buses that receive public funding. I've seeded articles about it. I can't link right now bc I'm on an iPhone (which is why my previous comment got mangled, too) but later I'll pull up stories for you, unless you want to google up New York, bus, segregation, Hasidic or similar terms.
- 11 votes
Why do the Abrahamic faiths, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, hate women?
I don't understand.
Women should be honored. Mother, the life giver.
- 8 votes
What is it with these fundamentalist religions and women?
- 12 votes
#7 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:57 AM ESTa nation never died from a lack of men.
you got one woman and 9 men, your growth rate is going to be about one or two kids a year. You have 9 women and one man, and your growth rate is going to be 9-18 a year
you attack a rival tribe, and you take the animals and the women.
I dont think religion invented it, but religion makes it easier to do; control the women.
TL;DR women make babies.
- 15 votes
Religion, not money, really is the root of all evil. And jerkish behavior.
- 7 votes
#8 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:44 AM ESTIsrael now has their very own "Rosa Parks"
- 9 votes
#9 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:59 AM ESTHere's what I never understood about the whole "Rosa Parks" and "Back of the Bus" thing.
I think the cowboy way. I want to be facing the front door, with a back door nearby in case a bad hombre comes gunning for me. I want the back seat, so that I have time to react and time to survive. I want the back seat, because if the bus crashes, the front door is gone, but I'm first in line for the back door.
Every cowboy in a front door is hopin' he'll find a back door open. That's me. I'm always looking for the best defensible space and the easiest retreat should it become needed.
I would be in the back of that bus. I would NEVER be that close to the entrance of a bus, especially not in an area so full of suicide bombers. Suicide bomber comes in the front door? Gene is out the back door before the bastard can finish "ALLAH AKBAR" and pull the fuse.
It's the same with airplanes. If you want to survive an airplane crash, then you're nuts to be sitting in First Class. 90% of the passengers will outlive the First Class fliers. Maybe by three seconds, but even so, sitting at the front ain't all that and a bag of chips. I don't do that.
I'd be totally cruel to this idiot who demanded the woman sit in the back of the bus.
Do you know what I'd sentence him to? 30 days of riding in a seat strapped to the front bumper of the bus. This dumbass wants to ride in the front of the bus, then by God give him what he wants in Spades. Strap him, handcuffed and gagged, to the front bumper of a city bus for a month and you'll never see his stupid ass demand to ride in the front of a bus again.
- 2 votes
Choosing where you sit is different than being told where you can sit.
- 10 votes
Rosenblit said the man called her a derogatory word for a non-Jewish woman, and told the driver it was his right to have her sit in the back and that he had paid to be able to do so.
How very polite and godly of him. Does he kiss his mother with that filthy mouth? And was she riding for free or did she pay to be able to sit anywhere she wanted? Maybe he should have offered to pay her fare, too. This brand of "religious" moron is one of the principal reasons there isn't peace between Arabs and Jews. Not the only one, but certainly one. Every religion has its share of jerks and usually they are the ones to be the most religious in the group.
- 15 votes
#10 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:16 AM ESTOh this cant be true, NOOOOO way. This is BS, they got the names wrong, something, cause all my right wing friends on the vine, say only islam sucks balls, only islam is oppressive, only islam has extremists.
They are all the same damn religion. Anyone looking in from the outside can see that. I guess the people inside the religious bubble dont have the proper view to see they are nothing more than sects of the same damn religion, with the same extremism problem. All of them. Yeah I can not name a christian who actually put on a suicide vest, I can name many murders, and really the extremists christians would do it if they could do it and will do it when they can.
look at david koresh, look at jesus camp
- 15 votes
#11 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:23 AM ESTDavid Koresh was murdered by the ATF, FBI and that baby-burning Janet Reno, Bill Clinton's front man.
He didn't go attacking others, and women were not devalued by his sect. His views were not politically correct by the standards of the day, but he was not a bad person. To lump him in with Muslim extremists is wrong.
- 4 votes
He didn't go attacking others, and women were not devalued by his sect. His views were not politically correct by the standards of the day, but he was not a bad person. To lump him in with Muslim extremists is wrong.
you dont load up on more guns than many national guard bases, preparing for the end of the war and have no plans to use them. HE ALSO RAPED A 15 YEAR OLD GIRL AND GOT HER PREGNANT. He had sex with many of the sect, including a 75 year old woman. They also dug up the dead to try to raise them. He was an extremist. Hate to break it to you, but he was.WHEN THE GOVERNMENT WENT TO SUBPOENA HIM, THEY OPENED FIRED KILLING 4 federal agents.
But if you want other extremists, there is erik prince the head of black water who said he was the head of a group of christian warriors. then there is that guy who had many child brides in texas.. and we can go on all day, if you want me to remove koresh.
- 10 votes
From the link @11.2....
Lois Roden died in 1986. Up until then Koresh had been teaching that monogamy was the only way to live, but suddenly announced that polygamy was allowed for him. In March 1986, Koresh first slept with Karen Doyle, aged 14. He claimed her as his second wife. In August 1986, Koresh began secretly sleeping with Michele Jones, his wife's younger 12-year-old sister. In September 1986 Koresh began to preach that he was entitled to 140 wives, 60 women as his "queens" and 80 as concubines, which he based upon his interpretation of the Biblical Song of Solomon. Koresh then built up an entirely new theology around his "marriage" to Doyle. This theology was called the "New Light," with a doctrine of polygamy for himself, which he called "The House of David." According to this doctrine, Doyle was supposed to have a daughter named Shoshanna who would then be married to Koresh's firstborn son Cyrus. However, Doyle failed to conceive, so Koresh then transferred his attention to his wife's sister. Former Davidian David Bunds said that Koresh's doctrine of polygamy "rose out of his deep desire to have sex with young girls. Once he was able to convince himself that it was God's will then he was able to be free of guilt and have sex with as many young girls as he could get his hands on."
Delusions of biblical grandeur.....sound familiar?
- 9 votes
My sentiments exactly #9. But then what more might be expected when considering a source Israeli ultra-Orthodox? It seems that community has been living in the past for decades and has lots of catching up to do. Where peoples lives, dignity, rights, and general welfare are concerned those hard nosed and hardline ultra-Orthodox types forever come up "a day late and dollar short" in addition to falling way behind the times.
- 3 votes
#12 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:25 AM ESTThe governor of the Bank of Israel, Stanley Fischer, stated that the growing poverty amongst the Ultra-Orthodox is hurting the Israeli economy.
According to the data published by Ian Fursman, 60% of the poor households in Israel are of the Haredi Jews and the Israeli Arabs. Both groups together represent 25–28% of the Israeli population.
We all know the israeli Arab population have very little options to change their status, but what is the Excuse for the Ultra-Orthodox citizens (general laziness does not count) ?
- 12 votes
The poorest town in the U.S., with more than 60
Percent on public assistance, is the Almost exclusively Hasidic enclave of Kiryas Joel, New York.
- 8 votes
60
Percent on public assistance, is the Almost exclusively Hasidic enclave of Kiryas Joel, New York.
Getting a Job seems to be low on their priority list, just like in Israel. They suck off the public tit, so they can devote 100% of their time to "study".
- 9 votes
It's time for all us sane people the world to put a stop these nuts of all religions. Lets put them right where they belong, in some institution. That way they can't infect the rest of the world with their illness. and they sit around and pray all they want in the day room.
- 4 votes
#13 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:39 AM ESTReligion caused the fall of Ancient Egypt
Religion caused the fall of Ancient Rome
Religion is causing the fall of the United States.
Religion is the pitting of one group against another, you know them vs us or we vs they.
- 4 votes
#14 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:23 AM ESTThe word was "shiksa", by the way, which is akin to calling non-Jewish women donkeys or animals. Which is why I get upset when I see non-Jewish people using the term for themselves. Most are unaware of the extremely pejorative imPlication.
- 13 votes
#15 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:31 AM ESTSo it is a Jewish equivalent of the "N" Word but used in relation to women?
- 9 votes
Yes, despite how some tv shows, etc. try to make it sound cutesy.
- 11 votes
Guilty as charged. As a non-Jew, I have used the term myself thinking it to be cutesy or having a neutral connotation. I won't do it again.
- 9 votes
In America, Shiksa is used humorously and mockingly in a self-deprecating way, however among the yltra-orthodox, its a real bad thing to call a woman (shegetz is the male equivalent).
Its like akin to a christian calling a christian woman a bitch, whore and an apostate all wrapped up into one convenient epithet.
- 2 votes
The "N" word is used the same way among blacks, but in America it is still a bad thing for members of other races to use the word because they use it in a derogatory and demeaning way.
- 2 votes
Israeli woman refuses ultra-Orthodox dictate to move to back of bus - Haaretz Daily Newspaper
The bigots apparently have faulty time machines and have reverse pole vaulted themsleves into Birmingham, Alabama!
- 10 votes
#16 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:53 PM ESTFunny enough, 'Crooks, that was the very first thought that popped into my head! "Looks like somebody hijacked Doc's DeLorean and went back to the '60s!"
- 3 votes
How long will this go on, women being subjected to the egos of men. In Saudi Arabia, a woman was sentenced to death for being a witch.
More power to the woman who refused to go to the back of the bus, another milestone for women. Another Rosa Parks. In some places women have to much power, in others they have no power.
More power to tha people.
- 5 votes
#17 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 2:44 PM ESTThe ultra Orthodox in Israel also stopped girls on the street they thought were dressed immodestly, and whipped them.
Unfortunately they are gaining more of a political influence in Israel .so women were banned recently from attending a festival in Israel, not in the Haredi neighborhood, because it would result in the mixing of the sexes.
- 10 votes
#20 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 4:15 PM ESTAnother common practice of the ultra-orthodox Jews in Israel is to walk up to Christian clergymen and spit at them.
- 11 votes
Goes to prove that all religions have their extremist, fundamentalist, theocractic my-religion-is-the-only-true-one nuts.
- 5 votes
#21 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 5:01 PM ESTAnd I would like to point to the Buddhist in the corner who is just watching and learning, never proselytizing. The Taoist on the other side of the room has a rather bemused look on his face.
- 9 votes
And I would like to point to the Buddhist in the corner who is just watching and learning, never proselytizing. The Taoist on the other side of the room has a rather bemused look on his face.
Hardly. Buddhists in places like Nepal and Bhutan have persecuted non-Buddhists. Google it. And I've talked to Taoists who aren't exactly enamored by other who doing share their religion. They may not have the power to persecute, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't if they did. All religions have their fanatics.
- 3 votes
Jerry,
Hardly. Buddhists in places like Nepal and Bhutan have persecuted non-Buddhists.
I Google'd it and couldn't find anything about it. I find it curious about Nepal since it is an overwhelmingly Hindu country.Can you provide links?
Bhutan has had some issues with human rights since the early 90's, but I have always heard with regards to ethnic and cultural issues, not religious.
- 4 votes
You forgot to mention we also have the rustlers, cut throats, murderers, bounty hunters, desperadoes, mugs, pugs, thugs, nit wits, half wits, dim wits, vipers, snipers, con men, Indian agents, Mexican bandits, muggers, buggerers, bush whackers, horn swagglers, horse thieves, bull dykes, train robbers, bank robbers, ass kickers, @!$%# kickers, and Methodists. You can see them attending church every Sunday.
This seems like a bit of a derail, and unless you want to put a /sarc, then it seems somewhat ...hmmmm...what's the word I'm search for?
- 2 votes
#22 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:04 PM ESTIf these anachronistic yahoos want to pretend it's the Middle Ages, why are they taking a bus anyway?
- 8 votes
#23 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:18 PM ESTAh, this hateful, ignorant, backwoods mental illness we call, "religion."
- 3 votes
#24 - Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:00 PM ESTThe solution to this problem is very, very simple.
Ban all ultra-orthodox men from public transportation.
It is for their own good: we don't want these weaklings getting sexually aroused when they are forced to sit next to women on the bus. And, of course, we don't want these "men's" rights violated. The best way to ensure that these "violations" do not happen, is to prohibit these "men" from using the same buses as decent, hardworking, honest people.
- 6 votes
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